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Author Topic: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?  (Read 2525 times)

DeviantProtagonist

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My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« on: July 30, 2016, 10:07:07 PM »
There's no strategy, let alone sense of pressure. At best? One can describe it as a grindfest. Setsuna had established this to great detail on her stream, so I felt inclined to share my reflection.

Back then, you either had time management or more importantly, festivals -- the latter was especially focal to iM@S, as it was the competitive component to challenge what the player learned.

You needed a game-plan to beat those, and now it's gone. As is, this problem extends to how linear notes are, right down to bursts; you just know when they're coming. Hardly any variation.

Now all you're worried for is the drops you get.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2016, 10:14:49 PM by DeviantProtagonist »
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zeda12123

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2016, 12:47:14 AM »
My biggest issue with the game is the lack on unique costumes. I'm still fucking salty, what the hell were they thinking.

Nakiame

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2016, 01:00:09 AM »
Yeah. I'm kinda disappointed in everything except visuals too.
No festivals.
No team management.
No costumes.
No songs.
No character communication but rankup lives.

Actually game has nothing but awesome graphics.
I'll continue playing it nevertheless...

Reikuo

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2016, 01:29:46 AM »
Well sorry to say, but this is what happens when "fans" let a company absolutely rob them like this by purchasing the DLC. Its just disgusting that Miracle Night is DLC. The first volume should not even have come out for a month. They also are saving most of the outfits for the event exclusive drops im sure. The only good news is that generally no matter the game a sequel on a new engine and console is never as content rich as its predecessor on a previous console. OFA was the third IM@S game to use that engine. This is the first to use this one and it most definitely took more work to create then OFA. Platinum Stars is pretty good in this regard. At the end of the day, in OFA there was no reason to replay the missions, at least with this new system that people call "Grindy" there is a reason to continue to play. OFA may have had a better system that im still shocked they did away with but at least there is a reason to play past the idol extreme without buying DLC. The pdrops are also good as they are basically DLC thats paid for by a small portion of the community that all can use for free. 
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Yukibro

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2016, 03:27:19 AM »
First, I'd say there probably wasn't a real sense of pressure in an iM@S game since SP. 2 would be close (I can't judge Hyper since I never tried it myself), but eventually you establish the easiest way to boost your ranking early on and the rest of it is simple. OFA and PS are immediately less pressured by having no time limit at all, meaning the only thing making events challenging would be your own lack of preparation. So really, they're both grindfests in their own way, more or less splitting the iM@S games between time management and time wasters... so to speak.

Second, as far as festivals go... well, I can see them being a beneficial feature but not really an important or critical one. If anything, it had its most importance in the 2/OFA era since the rhythm portions of that were so basic that a level of strategy suited them best. And I did like that, especially in OFA where you had to ration out memory appeals, bursts, and skills against your AI opponent's. That turned a pretty boring rhythm section in lives and festivals into something more robust, and it made the festivals critical to the game's challenge. Then again, it was also reliant on song BPM or team management in the post-game, meaning your options were limited unless you wanted to make it harder on your own.

As for how it is in PS, it seems the most critical concern is matching your outfit type with the live's type, and the rest comes down to tailoring the best outfits from drops and working from there. I haven't experimented with skills on outfits as much yet, and I'm sure stat training may be necessary in the endgame. And while I can say the notes can be linear and predictable to a point (moreso that you expect a certain number of X notes and you usually know when your burst is coming), the rhythm game is also not built around that same kind of strategy as 2/OFA had. You're more focused on full combos and better scoring than reacting to opponents, and while I can see the drawbacks in that, I actually feel like I'm having more fun with PS's rhythm game portion because it's actually rhythm. I'd like to see if they can add some more depth to it, of course, but 2 didn't have all the skills and strategy of OFA too.

My only real personal gripes so far are a lack of commus beyond story commus and the homogenized outfit system, both of which seem to cut more into iM@S as a series of getting to know cute girls wearing cute (and different looking) things. But on the whole, I can't really say I'm as disappointed as some are with Platinum Stars because it's still engaging to me as its own thing. I can't really comment on that until I feel like I've seen everything the game has to offer, though, so that's my two cents for now.

Byuusan

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2016, 05:35:12 AM »
I do feel some disappointment in the game myself.

The lack of outfit is a real issue. Really? most look the same.
there a good amount of songs so i won't argue about that, i think it about the same number for inital release?
They turned PS into a more rhythm based game instead of a strategy rhythm game. To be honest, i have no real issues with it. Course that would mean the lost of rival battles and festivals but that ok with me. I Think?
The lack of Communication. Really, there so little of it outside of Rankup Lives.
Grindfest. I have no issues with that. But it still sucks. I was hoping for something closer to 2.

From the lack of outfit, it is quite obvious they're saving outfits and accessories for events and DLC. I seriously hope you can do the event without using Pcoins.

Regardless of all this, i still love the game. While i do hate the lack of content, i still find what is in game very enjoyable. At least until the grindfest finally gets to me.

Imas:2 i stopped playing the story when i got all the outfit and got S rank Producer and every idol true end. Didn't help i recorded it so i can always rewatch it on my leisure.

OFA i stopped playing the core game when i cleared all the missions and got hte outfits. At least with PS, therea reason to keep going. I think it mostly the events but it a reason to keep playing.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2016, 05:39:59 AM by Byuusan »

Reikuo

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2016, 05:52:14 AM »
Grindfest. I have no issues with that. But it still sucks. I was hoping for something closer to 2.

Regardless of all this, i still love the game. While i do hate the lack of content, i still find what is in game very enjoyable. At least until the grindfest finally gets to me.

Imas:2 i stopped playing the story when i got all the outfit and got S rank Producer and every idol true end. Didn't help i recorded it so i can always rewatch it on my leisure.

OFA i stopped playing the core game when i cleared all the missions and got hte outfits. At least with PS, therea reason to keep going. I think it mostly the events but it a reason to keep playing.
Ill take the grindfest anyday over exactly what you described, nothing to do after beating the prior games.
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Monroviez

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2016, 08:36:03 AM »
Yeah. I'm kinda disappointed in everything except visuals too.
No festivals.
No team management.
No costumes.
No songs.
No character communication but rankup lives.

Actually game has nothing but awesome graphics.
I'll continue playing it nevertheless...

So is there even any underlying storyline in the game at all? Does each idol even have her own route/story like in previous games? Or is it just generic playing through performances and collecting costumes and accessories until you get boreDd?

Setsuna

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2016, 12:49:50 PM »
I have a LOT of reservations with Platinum Stars, but you also have to consider how the game was designed.

I can go on for weeks re: the game design but I'll try to compress that as much as possible.


Engine:

First things first - Platinum Stars is from a technical standpoint a huge improvement from the likes of OFA/im@s 2 (from an engine perspective)
A lot of time and care was placed in the engine and the various little details make the game visually and audioally (?) interesting.
So if you like PVs of live performances, then it's a straight up improvement. Songs were rerecorded, the visuals are significantly improved over OFA.
The costume list is lacking, but there's a particular reason for that (Which I'll cover later).
There's still flaws within their engine (Namely, hair management) but the stages and the like have a lot of work put into it.

Gameplay:

Let's get this out of the way first: Platinum Stars is designed to be a game that you play regularly, over the course of MONTHS. If not years. This has been a long standing failing of im@s generally, and this is the first actual attempt to address this flaw.

Did you read that above statement? Do you understand what I mean?

I'll make it clear what I mean - the biggest issue of im@s console titles is the fact that the content constantly keeps coming out well after the expectation of anyone playing the game for the game itself is gone.

Your average im@s idol run is what, 12-18 hours? If we assume 6 hours a week (weekend at 3 hours a day) you'd be expected to finish one every 2 or 3 weeks. None of the in game stats mattered at the end of catalog 12, because all the purchases were made well beyond after they finished the game. OFA would be done in about what, 25-30 hours, but for all of them.

The plan by design was to make it more social, namely, you'll be playing the game for an hour or two a few times a week, and you'd constantly keep coming back.

So if you're wondering why everything is now % chance based (namely, you have a chance after a live to get between 1 and 3 presents, and if you do, their size is randomised, and consequently you have a chance to get an item which could include costumes or accessories) now you know why. You'd have to constantly play to turn up all the costumes, and it's a matter of odds rolling to see if you fill your wardrobe.

This is coupled with the quite exponential curves (The total to reach B rank, which unlocks the sequence needed to finish the game requires 250k fans (Maybe 200k?) and A requires a million.) and a significant endgame, means you'll be there for a VERY long time trying to get through all the content. (I mean after you get the ending, there's a set of solo quests for each individual idol, as well as a series of Quintet only specials)

As well, this system allows for the release of free costumes for limited periods - Most people will pay for the P drops to boost their chances rather than spend the 10+ hours a day to force them to drop. It makes them money without mandating the upfront investment of a normal DLC item.


This WOULD have worked except one little problem:

- Until you see an idol's first ending, the game is mind numbingly easy.

Pro difficulty is VERY easy compared to say Hard on any Diva game.

So you may be given the impression that the game's so mindnumbingly easy, that it's not worth the effort to grind your way across. The main reason why Diva can have a long tail is because mastering an Extreme Song can take a literal forever, if you ever do.

Of course, this raises a problem within the game design - the moment you unlock ANY Master song, you can EX about any B ranked event (including the All Stars, which have obscene scoring requirements over the clear)... if you're good enough. There's about +50% more notes in Master over Pro, so your scoring potential jumps up about 75%.

The game difficulty jumps up significantly to actually give you a hard run for your money on Master. You'll routinely perfect pro given enough practice and probably can do it via reaction rather than practice. Master? Uh, no. This is where you're expected to actually put in practice time, and you'll find some songs will routinely kick your backside hard.

Also the difficulty of the game will depend on how lucky you are with the S ranked costumes - you can flat out be stonewalled out of progression (particularly late game) because a costume with a trait you need is asked for. At B rank, I might add.

Story:

Actually there's a lot of cutscenes, but they're minor skits. The only actual plot happens during the rankups, and the final before the first ending.

After the first ending, two things unlock in the SP section - A quintet line (Which I assume will lead to an All Star final) and a idol specific SOLO line.

Be warned, this is where the kid gloves come off. If you haven't mastered a master grade song, you are flat out 50/50 going to fail to reach the CLEAR minimum, let alone even touch the EX score requirements.

You're expected to clear the main story in a reasonable amount of time, but the extra stuff? Well,no.


----

As a summary - Platinum Stars is probably closer to Shiny Fiesta 2 than im@s 3 proper. It's an on rails rhythm game which has a really late curve, and a lot of the design is around playing it constantly for a very long time. The problem is that a lot of the mechanics are akin to MMO drops/Social/Free to Play, and can hamper your efforts if you're interested in putting X amount of hours with guaranteed progression.
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Teddie

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2016, 01:21:36 PM »
I'm quite dissapointed with outfits. I mean, over the course of 11+ years, iM@S has been having types of outfits and recolours of it. I mean, I love the new outfits, but the problem is that they're the same. Probably exeption are the Happy! outfits, they are kinda diffrent. Others are same looking.
Also, no EXTEND outfits. I mean, we have a Miracle Night outfit; But, where are Punkish Gothic or Beyond the Stars?

I wished that they revived some of the original songs. We have THE iDOLM@STER, Agent Yoru wo Yuku, 9:02pm, Positive!, but not: Here we Go! (5 years have passed, Namco.), Ohayou!! Asagohan, Taiyou no Jelausy, First Stage and let's not forget, Aoi Tori. Some of those fantastic classics from the arcade game.

The good thing is: the visuals. They're fantastic.

Is it just me, or Hibiki has blue hair? Probably going through Azusa phase (changing hair colours)...
« Last Edit: July 31, 2016, 01:25:11 PM by Teddie »


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Setsuna

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2016, 01:33:35 PM »
There's actually 4 categories of costumes now, not 3. Extend has been removed, and has had costumes shuffled the others.

The 4 categories are cute, cool, clever and cosmic. Cosmic has the only out of the ordinary set - which is the tracksuit.

The other note is that they're using a drip method. You know the I want event that's happening with the costumes they're not charging that will drop during the period? Yeah, that's where the wider variety of costumes went - towards extending the game by giving reason to come back on a regular basis.

They will be done about once a month and will all be free (for various definitions of free, I suppose) if you can get them to drop.
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Maka

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2016, 06:04:49 PM »
Things that I'm really not liking about this game:
(Keep in mind that I  don't actually own the game... and after reading feedback, I'm unlikely to.)
-Lack of unique costumes. Like someone said, what in God's name were they thinking? It's been a staple of the series since the arcade days and we're just randomly taking it out now? Really?
-No more normal clothes, everyone just chills in their tracksuit (which is universal to all girls, with no customization) at all times. This is like Leon always walking around in her stage outfit taken to an entirely new level.
-The existing costumes are very ugly. They're weirdly shiny (the main blue and white costume looks like it's made of plastic), poorly designed (Candy Seed/the pink and white outfit looks like it was a Cute&Girly reject from the arcade version), and just... Unappealing. Literally the only one I've seen that I like is the peach tartan one.
-The song lineup sucks. Image songs? What are those? Sure, Yayoi gets Kiramekirari and Haruka gets Go My Way, but those songs have been in literally every game since SP.
-No rivals. Granted, Leon was very after-thought-y, but we've had rivals in every mainstream game (including dearly stars, if you want to get technical) since 360. I haven't read anything about the plot yet, but... There doesn't seem to be one.
-From what I've seen, there seems to be around 7 or 8 unique stages. When you're just barely beating 360 and DS for stage count, then something is wrong.
-No guest lives. Ties in with no rivals, but...
-No festivals.
-Penlight movement was marketed as a ~*huge new feature*~ but it's just barely a step up from deresute, a game that costs the player zero dollars and zero cents.
-Even DLC is poorly done. Miracle Night is a great song but... One outfit and two old songs that are usually standard issue on the setlist? Isn't the first catalog supposed to be awesome?
-The entire concept of P drops.

Overall this game just seems... Disrespectful to longtime fans. I agree with Setsuna saying it seems more like Shiny Festa than a main series game, but even as a rhythm game things just seem incredibly half-assed. If they intended it to be a rhythm game with a low amount of the raising gameplay that imas is famous for, they should have marketed it as such.

The removal of longtime features that had been standard until now just rubs it in that this game was basically a money grab with no thought for fans.

This game seems half finished and unless Scamco implements some free updates to magically give the game a plot and remove everything they took out, I won't be buying it.

MetalPredat0r

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2016, 07:01:16 PM »
As someone who hasn't played the game (yet) but has seen the game streamed for hours, I can say that this is another unfortunate case of "A good game with no content".

The core gameplay with the rhythm game elements in the Lives look fine. The rhythm game is easy to grasp, especially if you've played Project Diva or Cinderella Girls Starlight Stage. And the game looks absolutely gorgeous. One of the best-looking "anime" games in terms of 3D modelling I've ever seen, even though Guilty Gear Xrd tops it. The characters have never looked better, the hair animates beautifully (when not clipping like hell), and the facial expressions are top-notch, almost perfected. Really makes the PS3 games look like crap by comparison.

But in terms of everything else, it feels..... barren. Like, costumes all look identical for every single idol, which is freaking dumb. No casual outfits. Commus are only limited to one event and one event only. The song list is lacking. There are no rivals, no story, and no sense of progression besides just doing things to get things.

I know some people will argue that OFA was the other way around, or how iM@S games are usually barren at launch, or how the game is good regardless. It's fine to enjoy the game for what it is, but do note that if the game launched with THIS many complaints here, on other message boards, and even in Japan for the exact same reasons, it's a flaw with the game in general. An iDOLM@STER game has never launched with this many complaints of an incomplete game besides MAYBE iM@S 2.

This might be an unfair comparison at first due to time, but Starlight Stage at the moment feels like a more complete game than Platinum Stars, and that's a free-to-play mobile game. While I know DereSute is almost a year old now and Platinum Stars isn't even out for a week, do compare the launch. Starlight Stage launched with about 70+ idols, a large variety of commus to unlock new songs or meet idols you obtained, and a setlist with some more variety, including having image songs that can be unlocked. And all future content released has been for free. Platinum Stars has all these issues with its launch, even with the first pack of paid DLC released.

I feel another big problem is something Maka mentioned, and that's how the game was promoted as a new mainline game when it doesn't feel like onet. In fact, I'd say the marketing for the entire game was terrible. Livestreams left out features which gave me worry that some elements would be removed or half-assed. I always had it in the back of my head that this game was essentially a tech demo so that Bandai Namco could get used to the PS4 in terms of iM@S, but promoted it as the next main game in the series just to shell out some cash, since admittedly, call any console iM@S game the next main game and it'll sell. This game is pretty much BNEI getting used to the PS4 so that the next game they can go more all out now that they had experience with the tech.

Maybe Platinum Stars will improve as time goes on, but as for right now, it's not a good look. I'm on and off about getting the game, personally. On one hand, I want to play a console iM@S game on a system I actually own, but on the other hand, seeing the game like this isn't selling me.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2016, 07:07:37 PM by MetalPredat0r »
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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2016, 08:31:21 PM »
Platinum Stars happens when Scamco thinks they can get away of it by half-assing gameplay elements, putting microtransactions in a freaking $80+ console game, and adding a new gloss into the graphics to cover up said problems hoping to milk the fans dry. I wasn't too excited when this game was announced but I didn't expect it to be worse as it is now.


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zeda12123

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Re: My one reservation with Platinum Stars?
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2016, 08:35:21 PM »
I agree with you guys, it feels like they skipped right over the mainline Im@s straight to the "console game that uses the first games assets but is more laid back". Like they skipped 2 and went straight to OFA as the flagship game or something.

Hopefully when/if we do get a proper Im@s3 it has the changes/additions they usually bring to a new mainline entry.